This is a second post from a 50-something anonymous Man-Fan. (You can read Part 1 here.) After experiencing so many women put themselves down, pull back from intimacy and not accept his compliments, he decided to share the man’s point of view. I hope you love what he says as much as I do. He’s a wonderful, generous teacher for us all. Thank you for choosing to share this on my blog Mr. Man Fan. You know I’m a HUGE fan of yours!
Bobbi consistently emphasizes the power of flirting. As a 54 year old single man who is dating regularly, I can tell you this:
Men have no defense against a good flirt.
It doesn’t matter what you look like or whether we know you are doing it, we melt. So, side note, it pays to hone your flirting skills.
Any woman older than 18 has probably long figured out that men are essentially powered by a reptilian brain stem with just enough gray matter to guide us to the fridge. We are literal and we take things literally. If a guy pays you a compliment, he actually does mean it and feels slighted if you don’t agree with him.
Guys don’t do ‘mercy dates.’ We’re too self-centered.
If you are using online dating to meet people, the first date (or as Bobbi calls it the “meet date”) may be to see if you actually look like your profile photo. (It goes both ways. I would say almost half of the women don’t look remotely close, so ladies, please do us both a favor and take Bobbi’s advice and update your online photos).
The second date may be to finalize an opinion pro or con. Ladies, if you are on a third date with a guy he thinks you are absolutely gorgeous. He thinks you are stunning. He isn’t with you because this weekend’s NFL game line up is mediocre. And to call things as they are, he’s thinking about getting you into bed.
The impact of this negative self-image is devastating, not just to you but to the guys who want to date you. In an earlier blog Bobbi mentions women who have such a negative self-image they would almost rather end a relationship than risk being seen unclothed by their partner. When I first read that my initial thought was, “That is outrageous. There is just no way. Maybe it’s one in a million women.” It’s not one in a million. I’ve had several promising relationships with wonderful women abruptly end for reasons I strongly suspect were related to this.
There is a distinction between a body ‘falling apart’ and simply changing.
As I mentioned earlier, men are fairly primal in their thinking. After the third date he is thinking about what you look like sans clothing. He may look like he’s putting together the quarterly budget report but he’s thinking about you and probably doing so every several minutes.
You’re so worried about what you think our reaction will be if we see you naked? You know what? We already know! I can’t divulge the man code but we have complex system of figuring it out. We know what you’ll look like and the sooner we can see it in person the better.
So, you’re a mom and have given birth. We don’t care! Or you have surgery scars or a few extra pounds. Again, we don’t care. There is a distinction between a body ‘falling apart’ and simply changing. Just because your body looks different than it did 20 years ago doesn’t mean we don’t think it’s beautiful.
Be open to the fact that what the media portrays as attractive doesn’t match with what real world men do. Be open to the fact that when men compliment you they sincerely mean it and accept them graciously.
Be aware that men are visual and if he asks you out it’s because he thinks you’re really attractive. And remember, the factors that make the largest impact with respect to attractiveness are within your control: they are your warmth and femininity.
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So…what do you think? Have you ever had a man who was interested that you ignored of resisted because you didn’t believe it? How are you with taking compliments? Has Mr. Man Fan changed your perception at all about men and what they want? Share your thoughts below!
Bobbi Palmer says:
Thanks for your comment, Maria. So glad it was helpful to you. Bp
Maria says:
This is a fantastic writing! I have read Part 1 and Part 2. I am so glad I did. It is so nice to hear from an honest man to help us “older” women realize that we are waaaay to hard on ourselves and our appearance! Even when I think about it now… I am actually very attracted to a man with a little bit of a belly, gray hair coming in and don’t even mind the receding hair line. So I guess it works both ways. So men…..don’t think every woman needs to have a man with six-pack abs and huge biceps and for heaven’s sake, DON”T dye your hair. If we are dating you, just like you…..we think you are attractive and you don’t need to change a thing!
Bobbi Palmer says:
Hi Rose, I understand your experience. Some women put out a certain “scent” and it’s a challenge to be seen past that. My advice is to share things about yourself that are authentic and meaningful asap. You don’t want to be aggressive, of course, but don’t hesitate to share some values, dreams, and what you are looking for in a relationship; especially the latter. Heres an article to help you https://datelikeagrownup-com.mystagingwebsite.com/the-one-word-you-can-use-to-magnetize-the-right-man/. And definitely stay out of bed until they understand all this and have shown you they are a grownup man looking for a relationship. And hey, even if a guy wants sex on a third date he doesn’t have to get it. Good Grownup Men will wait until a lovely lady like you is ready. If they won’t, f-them. Bp
Rose says:
Great article and testimonial from a man.
I personally believe men now when they compliment me and I do accept the compliments, I am confident in my sexy 46 year old body!
Though what bugs me is this phrase:
By the third date we know we want to see you naked asap, we want to get into bed with you.
Big compliment but for me something I feel so scared about!
Don’t get me wrong, I am a very sexual person and I appreciate that a man feels attracted to me… yet I had too many men being solely interested in my body and it saddens me soooo much!
I now cringe when I get compliments about how I look sexy, yummie, how great my hair is.
I’d rather have a man asking me how I am doing, complimenting me on the way I am a great person, a great mom, how I make him laugh…
Now when men compliment me all my defenses go up! Like: what are your intentions? Like the other 10 guys before you? Hit and run! I want a man who is attracted to me for more than just my body. Issue seems to be: once a guy puts you in the ‘sexy’ bucket, he doesn’t look beyond.
How can I navigate this?
I know many women would like to be seen more sexy by men, I would like to be seen less sexy and more as a person.
Bobbi Palmer says:
You’re entitled to your opinion but you are wrong , especially when it comes to older men. Remember that what you believe affects your actions, and your actions affect your results. So if you believe that it’s probably resulting in some bad experiences with men. Bp
Kerrie L Kelman says:
I think you are wrong. Men will always go after looks and they do not like strong personality women either
Helen says:
When I say meet at clubs I mean sports etc like book or kayaking, bowling type. Not let’s get drunk and loose judgement type clubs.
Helen says:
Hi there, I feel Mr Fan is really sweet or it’s really (you ) trying to encourage us women. I have turned many stones. First if a man pays me a complement I enjoy it and say thanks. I let it sit as earnest yet watch other cues which may make the compliment fall into the he just wants to get some and that compliment was supposed to be a big deal. When he says the stuf that most men don’t expect the magazine models or Beyoncé well that unfortunately I’ve found at at least 50/50. I date for months at least before any intimite encounter if at all. That has been redefined. For example what is premarital sex if no one ever got married? Then it’s just sex. Usually the first date there would be a glitch. A deal breaker. Like I meet in a public place and the person shows up his add said looks of Micheal Landon. He was blond and chubby. I asked looks of Michael L. He said oh my friends said with my cowboy hat I looked like him. So he was special. Another said he had dark brown curly hair. He wore a wig that when I touched it n found out it scared me. I trusted the description until I touched it in the back of his neck felt the hem. Had two guys give me their license numbers etc and still try to rape me. One was a daytime lunch date, I thought because he gave the info without any problem and it checked out that I would be safe. Especially for lunch. But when he drove me to drop me off he said I’ll park and come in. I said no thanks this is a first date I would not have anyone stop in. Then as soon as he put it in park he started grabbing at me and me clothes. Keep in mind it was only 1:30 or 2 in the afternoon in a car with no hint of tint he pulled this. The other happed as he went to drop me after dinner. Also a first date. I did not let them know where I lived anyway. But learned if you meet online or the newspaper meet in public keep it simple. And no ride home. A person I dated for a while gave me a comment that really did make me feel hurt when he said it. But I felt he was so immature not in years but just a jerk. We had been together quite a while and after about 8 months moved in together. Maybe it was the first time with more light on but when he glanced at the stretch marks on my abdominal area he gasped loudly saying “Oh my God we’re you in a fire”?? That was cruel and ignorant I felt. Any way with internet porn and magazines I don’t think Mr. perfect has it right. Women are still under a microscope. But all anyone can do is give it a shot. Gotta be in it to win it. I think clubs or activities you like can be a good meeting place or church. Any suggestions are good but the other item is now I am Christian and have no intention of bed hopping. If that is all there is I’ll pass. I want real or nothing. Someone willing to invest themselves as I am too.
Bobbi Palmer says:
Hi Chris, I’m so glad you’re here and thanks for your thoughtful message. Every woman needs to read this. In fact, I may post it as an article! I 100% agree that expecting perfection (among other things) is preventing a lot of otherwise good relationships from forming. Absolutely! Here’s an article I wrote about it: Imperfection Does Not Equal Dating Rejection.
There are SO many women who are looking for the same thing as you. And a man like you who is self-aware, thoughtful, smart, single and looking for lifelong commitment! As I tell my ladies: there is no giving up. Change it up. Do it differently. Learn new things. She is out there and waiting for you to find her. BTW you might want to look at my friend, Allana. She does wonderful work with men. Sending light and love your way! Bp
Chris says:
I am a 54 year old reasonably attractive single guy who is looking for a marriage partner. I can honestly say that if I met the woman who I felt could be the right life partner, I would not be deterred at all by scars or mastectomies. It just would not be an issue from my end. I have had my own medical issues and have my own scars and lingering issues. So the question from me would really be, would the woman be able to accept me? I still have not found one that can. I am hoping that one is out there though. I think that expecting perfection (among other things) is preventing a lot of otherwise good relationships from forming. I find that both sides can tend to have unreasonable expectations and demands about “stuff,” whether material or physical. When really, the foundation of a healthy, non-shallow relationship should mostly be about character, maturity, kindness, gentleness, sincerity, honesty with self and others, connection, intimacy, openness, willingness to share, shared values, willingness to work on oneself, and being able to work and function as a team, among other things. Physical attraction is important as well, I don’t dismiss that because I would want to look forward to kissing and hugging my wife every day. But the collective pressure to be physically perfect is just killing the spirit of so many of us. So are the harshly critical and ungrateful attitudes that many men and women seem to have toward each other. My hope is that I can eventually meet someone who has grown up qualities and is not looking to make life fit into a fairy tale. I hear they exist and hope they do, but have not encountered one yet. Thanks for listening.
Bobbi Palmer says:
Hi Nina, so glad my work helps you! One thing though: I suggest that you keep getting to know him without the sex talk. It can get in the way of real connection at the beginning of a relationship. Decide what your boundaries are. What do YOU need in order to feel ready to have sex? Here is an article to read: https://datelikeagrownup-com.mystagingwebsite.com/when-should-i-have-sex-with-him-dating-over-40/
You can let him know how much you like him and that you feel wonderful that he’s so attracted, and that you need [tell him your boundaries]. I want you to feel safe; emotionally, physically and spiritually, sister. Hugs. Bp
Nina says:
I just started a relationship, 3rd date is tomorrow! He is head over heels, sent me flowers after 2nd date. Yes talks about sex ALOT asks me what I like! Tells me what he likes! I’m freaking out. Then flowers come to office after 2nd date( he remembered the colors I like) card said ” you have touched my heart and my soul” I was touched. We talk he likes to talk about more sex! Then I get another sweet text that says you are more beautiful then any young girl , you beat them all, I miss you. Third date tomorrow, I get it! the article helped from Mr Man I do know this man really wants to get me into bed! But I also know he really likes me and told me he is looking for a life partner. I also think in his 21 year marriage he was in abandoned emotionally and has not had a sexual connection. There ya go. I m really going to try and stop over thinking this and enjoy it! Thanks BP your blogs are so helpful.
Bobbi Palmer says:
Hi Sophia. Unfortunately I have many, many clients who have survived breast cancer and have visible effects like you. I’m so sorry about that. But let me tell you that men – grownup men – really don’t care. They aren’t the 28 year old boys who only care about playing with girls’ boobies. They are looking for a partner and they, too, have likely been through medical issues, etc. Also like you, they have perspective on what really matters and what doesn’t in life. Sure, this isn’t true of every man you might meet; but if your picker is pretty well honed to finding ‘grownup guys’, it will be true.
So please PLEASE dump the idea that men won’t want you. It’s not true. And you only need one! And please also allow yourself to stop framing who you are based on your chest area. Instead, do more work on getting in touch with all the other fabulous qualities that make you special and desirable. I bet there are many!
And then, after you get to know a man and think he might be someone with whom you would be intimate, tell him in the way I suggest about anything else that’s scary. “Bob, there’s something I’d like you to know about me.” Don’t give him details, just let him know you are a survivor (or however you choose to express it) and that you had a breast removed. And then, tell him anything positive that came out of the experience. I hope for you that there was some silver lining. Share that with him and that’s it. If he’s like so many other men my gals have done this with, he might be concerned, ask a question or two, and thank you for telling him. And then he’ll want to jump into bed with you! Hope this helps. Be good to yourself, Sophia. Bp
Sophia says:
I lost a breast to cancer and I am afraid I am no longer sexy naked (you can’t tell clothed, because I wear a prosthetic). The insecurity is holding me back from being the actively dating divorcee I would otherwise be. Is raising the topic the equivalent of the herpes conversation? Bobbi, you are so good at framing how to consider things. How do I should I be thinking about myself and how should I approach dating.
Bobbi Palmer says:
Absolutely, Jane! Thanks for your comment. I appreciate that you are here! Bp
Jane says:
Thanks so much, Bobbi for publishing these posts from men. I find them very interesting and incredibly refreshing. I agree that we women are way too hard on ourselves. You need to just let go and just enjoy the moment and I put myself in that category! LOL!
Bobbi Palmer says:
Hi Mary Alice, I’ve been there! I used to be the gal who never got asked to dance. Please be sure you are making eye contact and smiling. Make sure you are showing your confidence and openness. I realize some guys are going to go for the skinny young chicks no matter what (sorry, but we older not-skinny girls kinda hate you) but 95% of the men really are looking for the friendly and confident woman. They want to dance with (and date) someone they can talk to and enjoy being with. Be sure you are being her, even if after a little while you feel “wilted.” (I SO know what you mean by that!) Keep your head up, sister. Keep dancing!!
With love and support, Bp
Lori says:
Just like Part 1 of this series, I let my new GUB (grown-up boyfriend), who happens to be 45, read this. He nodded and agreed with it all, including the “man code.” He did share one more “man code” tidbit with me: if you are at the point in your relationship where you are getting naked with your grown-up guy, he’s not going to end the relationship because of anything to do with your naked body. Those imperfections aren’t deal-breakers! He’s willing to love and accept them, and so should we.
Marie says:
Kimberly, I share your feeling of not wanting to be “used” just for sex, but I don’t think this is the intention of all men. Having just listened to Jonathon Aslay’s great audio about communicating with men, one thing really struck me. He said most men spell intimacy SEX, while most women spell intimacy TALK.
Men do want to get to know you, that’s why they’re still going on dates with you. And just because they’d like to have sex with you doesn’t mean you have to comply before you’re ready. I’ve always waited a good 2 months before having sex to see if I even want to go to that next step with a man.
Bobbi Palmer says:
And we love YOU, David. Thank you so much for sharing here. It means a lot to me…to all of us! Much love, Bp
Bobbi Palmer says:
Nuff said. Thanks TJ!!! Bp
Bobbi Palmer says:
Kimberly, I think you may be missing something here. He already has decided that he wants to get to know you. That’s why he says by the third date he’s thinking of you naked. This is a man who is looking for a real relationship. You wouldn’t be getting to the third date at all if he didn’t like you and want to get deeper. Now…he’s really thinking of you naked.
You may want to think about whether your assumptions about men shade the way you read this? What do you think?
Mary Alice says:
Maybe. But I am frequently at Ballroom dance events where I am sitting (or standing) in the same general area as too skinny, somewhat-younger, bleach-blondes. I wear a dress, get out on the floor as much as possible, smile; most people think I am about ten years younger than my age.. But sometimes, I also sit there and watch the two bleach-blondes get asked onto the floor over and over… while i sit. i must admit that I start to wilt a little. Maybe men looking at pictures of particular women for online dating are not necessarily attracted to skinny. But in real life? Can be very discouraging.
kimberly says:
I see the positive in what he has shared. Kudos for helping women know that they are beautiful at any and every age.
Although I must be the odd-lady-out of the audience and do not find it flattering to know that if I am asked out for a third time it is because he wants to get me in bed. I think I understand the difference between men and women, generally, that men think about sex far more frequently than women. I would presume if there is attraction then the man may be envisioning me naked by the first date.
What is really hot and attractive to me is for a man to compliment me, truly mean it and have a desire to want to get to know me far deeper as a person by the third date.
TJ says:
After reading Mr. Man’s thoughts, I’m ready to throw caution… and my bra… to the wind! Thanks for the insight, and the pep talk, Mr. Man. I truly respect your straight talk and generosity.
David says:
My current girlfriend had breast cancer long before I met her. She had her entire left breast removed and reconstructed along with a huge surgical scar on her stomach. I had no idea what to expect the first time.
None of it mattered a whit to me. She is the sexiest woman I have ever been with. It actually made her more interesting.
So smile, take it off, and be proud. We’ll love every minute of it. 🙂
Tammy says:
I once went out with a man for a few months. We saw each other once a month. I lost 60 lbs. and he never noticed. I had to tell him.that’s when I realized he must not see women as we do. So critical. I loathe all the “petite women” only ads. I’m a size 16-18. I have the same 60 to lose again.
50 different women in a year makes me wonder about quality. That’s over 4 per month. Too fast for me.
I read your articles and pass along. I can date more like a man now.
Thanks Bobbi!
Bobbi Palmer says:
Hi Lori! I know it can be scary, but my experience has been that most men are OK with it. Some aren’t, but you should know that early on. Here is my advice about how to tell him. Gives you exact words. Best to you! https://datelikeagrownup-com.mystagingwebsite.com/2013/06/video-how-do-i-tell-him-i-have-herpes/
sandra says:
Yes, Bobbie, it is. So refreshing and entertaining (I mean that in a good way) to see a man be honest …love it!
Lori says:
This is great news! But how does one handle telling someone they have herpes? My ex gave it to me after an affair. I am seeing someone who has great potential but I am scared to tell him. We are not sexually active.
Bobbi Palmer says:
Hi Sandra, Thanks for your comment. I lOVE it! And yes, this REALLY is written by a man! It’s fantastic, isn’t it? Bp
sandra says:
Yes, my idea has changed dramatically! I am ready to get naked LOL! really though, this is enlightening. Is this really written by a man, I am suspicious. Do we, as women, get so caught up in our heads that we blow it that badly? I am beginning to think we have waaay too much going on in these brains. WEll, first of all many of of us are ‘taught’ to be ‘ladies’ and resist the desire that we feel when guys do compliment us or are attracted, secondly we have matured so much that we suspect there is more going on and it may not all be on par. Well, enough of that! I say, more carnal, less thinking! thanks for the insight – i am going to look at men more openly now and appreciate the comments I get because they really are trying to get me in bed LOL but in a good way! (PS I know there is more to it, but this is pretty cool to know that they appreciate us for how we look and not seeing as just objects….that is what he is saying right?)